Tuesday, December 16, 2008

Ending the Favre vs. Rodgers Debate

It's been the most heated debate in Wisconsin sports this year, and quite possibly in our state's illustrious history. Were the Packers right in trading Brett Favre to accelerate the career of Aaron Rodgers? We've had many discussions on this all season, the latest being in the comments of the "Just Accept That It's Over" post. Well now, for one last time, I would like to end the discussion by releasing The Official Bucky Channel Statement Regarding Rodgers vs. Favre.

To begin, let's go over what we've talked about already:

* Brett Favre is the greatest quarterback to ever play for the Green Bay Packers. I enjoyed watching him play for the Green and Gold while I grew up. He was an idol to me, just like he was to every other kid in Wisconsin.

* The retirement talk that has been going on since the 2003 season was growing old. So was Favre's routine of not shying away from it.

* I was heartbroken when Favre retired. Especially after a year in which Green Bay was so close to going to the Super Bowl.

* When he retired, I wanted him to stay retired. This "will he or won't he" off season routine had gone too far, and him trying to un-retire officially crossed the line. When he starting acting like a bitch in the off-season, he crossed the line even further.

* I said I didn't have a problem with you if you rooted for Favre this season, but some of you broke a couple of the rules. I said no wearing Favre Jets jerseys to Packers games!!!

* I'm not sure what the extent of the Favre/Millen conversations were, but Jay Glazer just doesn't make up stories.

Now, after 15 weeks of the NFL, the Packers are officially out of the playoffs, the Jets could win the AFC East, and Brett Favre has been voted to the Pro Bowl. Now that we've seen how it's all shaken out after year one, this is what I am sticking by:

* No matter how good Favre could have played this year, I was going to stick by my opinion that the Packers are better off in the long term by going with Aaron Rodgers this year. I planned to stick up for Rodgers no matter what, and with how well he played this season, it wasn't hard to do at all.

* To call Rodgers "un-clutch" is not entirely fair. He has brought this team back in many games to be leading in the final five minutes of the 4th quarter. That being said, it is true that he has not yet won a game on the last possession. So while it's not fair to call Rodgers "un-clutch", by no means has he truly demonstrated the characteristics of a clutch quarterback. I'd say he falls somewhere in the middle.

* The Packers have two defensive starters in the Pro Bowl mainly because of the big plays they made at the beginning of the season. The defense has been an absolute joke ever since that Saints game, and is the main reason the Packers haven't won a game since.

* Brett Favre has played better than expected with the Jets. If you are one of the many that followed him over there, than I am happy you have had something to cheer about. But if you've cheered against Aaron Rodgers on even one play this season because of your commitment to Favre, then don't ever come back.

* As good as Favre may have played, the Jets as a whole have played better. Favre, based on this season alone, does not deserve a Pro Bowl selection. If the Jets would have had the same season with Chad Pennington at quarterback, Pennington would have not have made the Pro Bowl (Want proof? He didn't make the Pro Bowl having a similar season with the Dolphins).

* How was trading Favre all of a sudden the Packers decision? Who's not to say that this whole retirement was orchestrated by Favre so that he could be traded? Hmmm?

* I did not root for Favre this season, and will not root for him going forward. I thank him for all the memories he has given me, and I hope the Packers and him are someday able to reconcile the right way. But not anytime soon.

* Favre is getting a lot of mileage out of those three MVPs ten years ago. With all the times he has broken our hearts over the last decade, I seriously can not understand how some of you still defend him to your death.

* I am very disappointed in the play-calling of Mike McCarthy this season, as well as the performance of Ted Thompson. The Derrick Frost experiment is unforgivable.

And most importantly...

* The Packers were not going to win a Super Bowl with Brett Favre this season, or next season, or ever again. They proved that last year, when Favre absolutely choked in the Giants game. You want to talk about not being clutch? Exhibit A. That being said, it was in the Packers best interest to go forward with Rodgers. I would rather this season be a mess with Rodgers at QB then be 10-6, first round playoff exit with Favre.

Remember, we're only one season into the Aaron Rodgers Era. Let's wait awhile before we declare this a mistake.

And that's it. No more Favre talk on this blog, at least until the New Year. I'm sick of it.


Anonymous said...

The people who hate Rodgers are probably the same people who wanted Favre benched in his first few years. I agree with you completely, and I hope that most Packer fans do as well.

Anonymous said...

Um, Winks, I am sorry for the "unclutch". Can you tell me a better way to articulate it, pretty please?

Actually, I don't hate Rodgers, anon. I felt he would be fine. But yeah, whatever makes you feel better. I had seen Favre at S. Miss. on TV and he was this wild man who could throw like crazy and I loved his exuberance. The first game as a pro Favre played I was a sophomore (I'm old) in high school, and suffered through getting so close but not enough with Majik. Favre, in his first game, threw a touchdown in the last second to win the game. In his second year in the league. It was, I don't know, it was the greatest thing after all of those years. You could just feel it. I personally felt that Favre earned the capital to have hesitation. I agree that Favre probably did want to play for the Vikings. I think that every year not seeing things being done to improve talent around him was frustrating, as he worked his ass off here. You think Peyton Manning will ever have to deal with that? I think he saw a more proactive franchise in Minnesota that would have a better chance to do what he really wanted, to win a Super Bowl. He saw a team moving on (to what?) around him. I believe, and with the 25 million dollar bribe, that there is some truth to the thought that the Packers, especially Thompson, did not want Favre here for years for whatever reason. He obviously did, too. As you can see this season, we are in trouble. We have no offensive or defensive line. Our outside linebackers are atrocious. Our secondary stars are getting way out of their prime. I just don't see any replacements waiting in the wings and since TT is all about 5th, 6th, and 7th rounders and not really going to FA I don't see that improving soon. The NFL waits for no one. That is cliche' but it is also true. The coaches have lost the team this year and I cannot understand why there is not more of an uproar, even disregarding Favre. Players are openly fighting. The last talented team I saw doing that was the Vikings with Randy Moss and Cris Carter. I had to frickin' live in MN for 5 years so I had to deal with those dick fans every day. I always had a trump card. I don't feel that way anymore. The problem began when it was put that, "we had to get over it" and accusations that we were not Packer fans if we did not agree. I'm sorry, I did not know anyone had a monopoly on that sort of thing. People obviously felt, many different things and lined up that way. I also do not have any Jet gear, so that can be put to rest.

You want to debate the Giants game? Really? How about Plaxico Burress making Al Harris his, well look bad? Really? How about running the ball 13 times the entire game in -45 degree weather when the week before Grant had 200 yards rushing? Really? How about Bush not easily falling on a fumble at the end of the game? See, I can go all day. But yes, the last pass was insane but you knew that was a possibility just as I knew it was a definite for the result on Sunday against the Jags, with an Int. Everyone watching knew it, too. Just as much as you knew that the D would not stop them you knew what was coming next on offense. What is kind of funny is I always got so pissed when people booed Favre his first years, I seriously could not understand it. Mancrush, whatever. It seems with what you have written before you can relate to that with about 10 athletes, Winks. I said this before and I will say this again. Chicago Bulls, 1999. Michael Jordan. Jerry Krause. Pride of G.M. vs. team chemistry. How did that work out for them? Oh yeah, it didn't. I am just afraid that that is the destiny we are in for. So yeah, this is obviously an issue for me, and you. I came to this blog looking for a Wisconsin perspective last year and came every day after. Then this summer happened and I turned into an "unclutch" troll who writes 8000 word comments. I hate that guy, and he is me. This is like a microcosm of the what has happened to fans all over. It feels like 2003 before the stupid war. That should tell you how unreal all of this is and there is no way anyone comes out better. I am sorry but I have seen this movie before, with other teams, and it never has a happy ending. I appreciate you addressing the issue and hopefully, someday we all get over what has been a pretty crappy few months. I think a big way to exorcise those demons is for change. It is the only way. Thanks again for your work on this blog and really, thanks for helping me with my english comprehension. I wish I had gone to UWL rather than UW. There, that is some UW snobbery for you. :}

Anonymous said...

I really am an idiot, It is Plexico. Ugh.

Winks said...

Despite the fact that I may disagree with you, you do write a very compelling story.

What I do like is you comparing this to the 2003 war. Can you really compare the magnitude of the Iraq War to the NFL? No, not the magnitude. But as far as a single event polarizing what was once a united group of people, well then that's not a bad assessment.

I hope this Packers team doesn't become the movie you've seen before, and I don't think it will be. For whatever reason, this year is probably the least mad I have ever been about missing the playoffs. Maybe some of that is due to the fact that I know we're not in for another playoff heartbreak by Favre (ha), but I just feel very confident in Rodgers and the future of this team.

Although, Bear is right. This team needs to starting spending some cash. And if I start to bash anyone in the coming months, it will likely be McCarthy before Thompson.

Now for the sappy part, I do appreciate you not only taking the time to read this blog, but to get involved with your 8000 word comments. That ultimately gets lost in these arguements, is that in the end we're all rooting for America's Dairyland.

And, for the last time, even though I went to UWL, I have very few good things to say about it!

Anonymous said...

Yeah, good stuff. I see your side of the arguement for sure. The part about the 8000 words rings true here as well. I guess you could say I tend to get defensive in my arguements as well.

At any rate, we both agree that for the Packers to get the team moving forword again is to assess both the offensive and defensive lines. Again, I like to think of myself as an optimist. If that makes me a homer than so be it. But I beleive this team can turn it around in one year.

You are essentially right in one of the posts you wrote in a post down a ways about me and winks being 24. You are right we have been spoiled. For the better part of my existance I have seen a relevant and popular Green Bay franchise. Are we headed for the 70's and 80's well I hope not but at the same time, I don't know those Packers teams so I am optimistic that isn't going to happen here. There is something to be said about that. The polarization does seem to be very generational.

Here's to hoping the Packers are back on top next season.

Anonymous said...

Thanks, guys. You have always handled yourselves better than I have here, even when I came to antagonize. And for that you are to be commended. See? This is catharsis for me. You saved me 200 bucks an hour to lay on the couch. Priceless. See what I just did there? It is going on my sign.

Anonymous said...

ive been weary on favre since a rodge got in the cowboys game and favre just looked absolutely pissed that rodgers was doing well. after all the support rodgers gave favre, and favres over there looking more upset than deanna after she found out he cheated on her 1000 times.

i just hated how favre took on a larger than life persona. thats probably the thing that pisses me off the most, because i was as guilty as anyone of building up that persona. i worshiped the guy, but this summer i couldnt ignore how shitty a human being he really is. i put the drug addictions and infidelity and the bitching about not getting moss and all that shit aside and held this cocksucker on a pedestal. this summer, i was severely let down by just a really shitty guy, and its entirely my fault. thats what pisses me off the most.

to be honest, im at the point now where im booing favre when he comes back to lambeau. i sincerely hate him and i just dont think thats going to change. once i woke up and realized what a dick he was, how can i ignore it all again? i really just hate the guy.

Unknown said...

I love the post B2. I feel the same way about the prick.

TZar said...


No matter what happens and I was so sick of all his bullshit as well, I will never hate this man. 90% of pro football players are ego maniacs and dirtbags behind the scenes. On the field, he gave us everything.

Now, the thing that pisses me off the most, are the fans that threw A-Rodg under the bus. I remember when Elway retired being shocked at how a pretty good fan base (not anywhere near the loyalty of Packer fans) could throw Griese under the bus. A lot of Packer fans have shown their true colors this season. If you can 't get behind this team and would rather watch the Jets, then stop commenting on the Pack. You're not wanted.

Anonymous said...

There was that one movie, starring a guy named Montana. They had to change the main actor as well. Different circumstance, but it still turned out pretty good.

For the record, this is the same anon as above. I have never read the comments before, so I was not picking anyone out of the crowd, Antonio.

Well, keep up the great blog. I'll have to keep checking in on the comments. They're actually civil.

Anonymous said...

Suggestion Winks, never post that old fart qb's name ever again on this website. I'm sick of seeing his name in half of your posts.

Winks said...

Now that's the smartest thing I've heard yet.

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